Low lawfulness and redlist idea

[phoenixdoll]

As far as I am aware, currently if i add a gentry/noble to the redlist it functionally has no effect while still costing the influence cost.

I think the redlist should be expanded so that that the mobs which spawn northside with low lawfulness target characters on the redlist, including gentry/noble characters.

Also (if it already doesn't function like this:) being on the redlist should overwrite having a writ.

[Sparkles]

I think the redlist should be expanded so that that the mobs which spawn northside with low lawfulness target characters on the redlist, including gentry/noble characters.

If this was going to be a change, we'd need to address those NPCs randomly spawning inside other Guild's GHs including behind xblocks.

[phoenixdoll]

I think the redlist should be expanded so that that the mobs which spawn northside with low lawfulness target characters on the redlist, including gentry/noble characters.

If this was going to be a change, we'd need to address those NPCs randomly spawning inside other Guild's GHs including behind xblocks.

Do they spawn inside guild HQs or just walk past xblocks?

[Sparkles]

Do they spawn inside guild HQs or just walk past xblocks?

I'm not 100% if it's one or the other (or both.)

That being said while I love this idea I do wonder if it's going to encourage against RP rather than add to it. Redlisting makes mobs lethal and if you are someone who can randomly encounter lethal random NPCs on grid any time you walk around, that's likely going to encourage towards reclusive behavior.

[Deedee]

Redlisting someone doesn't make mobs lethal, only lethal mobs currently enforce the redlist. The redlist script is just far more aggressive towards redlist members than the script towards the usual targets (upper class and the fuzz), and 'mercy' may not work if redlisted. Being redlisted does override writs, since it's a different script enforcing it than the standard thug script.

If redlisting applied outside of the lethal mobs, they would attack but they wouldn't finish if they knocked them out. Perhaps they could be made to call (load) lethal mobs to attack a redlist member though. I wouldn't mind giving the brotherhood such power, but it may be best if it applied to the same standard as excommunication and exile, both in cost and needing staff approval.

[mystry]

Redlisting someone doesn't make mobs lethal, only lethal mobs currently enforce the redlist. The redlist script is just far more aggressive towards redlist members than the script towards the usual targets (upper class and the fuzz), and 'mercy' may not work if redlisted. Being redlisted does override writs, since it's a different script enforcing it than the standard thug script.

If redlisting applied outside of the lethal mobs, they would attack but they wouldn't finish if they knocked them out. Perhaps they could be made to call (load) lethal mobs to attack a redlist member though. I wouldn't mind giving the brotherhood such power, but it may be best if it applied to the same standard as excommunication and exile, both in cost and needing staff approval.

Not a fan of allowing the Brotherhood to just spawn lethal mobs on top of people. Maybe a spawn a non-lethal mob, the 'ol 'break their knees so they get the hint'. But not lethal.

[wimple]

That being said while I love this idea I do wonder if it's going to encourage against RP rather than add to it. Redlisting makes mobs lethal and if you are someone who can randomly encounter lethal random NPCs on grid any time you walk around, that's likely going to encourage towards reclusive behavior.

I think if it's north side, it should be non-lethal. That said, I think in situations like this, RP just moves around. When there was that spree of people being killed, I never got more RP as a combat trainer, and it encourages peoples to be in groups. NPC guards could also interfere, which would make it more flavor than actual risk for gentry/noble types (particularly if non-lethal).

[phoenixdoll]

Redlisting someone doesn't make mobs lethal, only lethal mobs currently enforce the redlist. The redlist script is just far more aggressive towards redlist members than the script towards the usual targets (upper class and the fuzz), and 'mercy' may not work if redlisted. Being redlisted does override writs, since it's a different script enforcing it than the standard thug script.

If redlisting applied outside of the lethal mobs, they would attack but they wouldn't finish if they knocked them out. Perhaps they could be made to call (load) lethal mobs to attack a redlist member though. I wouldn't mind giving the brotherhood such power, but it may be best if it applied to the same standard as excommunication and exile, both in cost and needing staff approval.

Not a fan of allowing the Brotherhood to just spawn lethal mobs on top of people. Maybe a spawn a non-lethal mob, the 'ol 'break their knees so they get the hint'. But not lethal.

I mean, I didn't ask for the redlist to spawn mobs on top of redlisted people in my original post!

If that's something staff and the playerbase would consider, I'd gladly accept those mobs being non-lethal as a more "break your knees" kinda thing, and have that not be tied to city metrics at all.

In fact, I think that's a much better suggestion than my idea. To be clear, I feel that's wayy more power than I've been asking for, but I mean. It would be a definitely acceptable option to me, because it wouldn't be tied to getting a city metric low and would reflect the IP spend. 10 IP according to helpfiles. In the fluff that's like.. I've told my dudes I'm pissed at someone for whatever reason, I've gone and worked the crowd into a state of blood lust wanting their head. But they'll only whack the dude if the idiot makes the mistake of coming back to Southside. And, honestly, they'd probably already do it without any effort on my part if they were gentry or noble.

My original suggestion was just for the mobs that spawn in low lawfulness to target redlisted individuals. I don't mind those mobs being non-lethal, (I'd prefer they remain so and believe the mobs that spawn are still non-lethal), 'cause sending someone to the hospital's a pretty strong message.

I see the argument that during dangeous periods people just group up, or become reclusive. I think this is a fair criticism, but I still think that it would lead to RP as I believe that any kind of combat happening Northside alerts the Reeves, so I would feel that this would potentially add to RP for the Reeves, but I stand to be corrected on combat vs NPC. It would let people pay me $$ to have someone redlisted. If people don't pay their protection money, I can actually follow this up with something beyond just using the plots system.

It would mean that if you have those NPCs lingering where they shouldn't, there'd be a mechanical impetus to get them dealt with because.. they'd be doing something other than just wandering about. I have personally RPed calling the Reeves on a dodgy NPC that wandered into my phome on my gentry alt and that was a fun scene. It would also be cool if BH had a command to dismiss these NPCs from inside guilds, but I have NO idea how hard that would be to impliment.

It's pretty hard to play an antagonising force in TI with the low player pop at the moment. I don't want to introduce mechanics that are going to just frustrate players OOC and make them give up, but wouldn't it be nice if the less friendly organisations on grid had teeth? If there was.. well.. anything to be frightened about? Currenty I have this weird imbalance where I'm supposed to be the shadowy leader of this powerful crime organisation, but there's very little mechanically supporting this.

To be clear, I'm not asking for all mobs that appear northside to become lethal or just target people willy-nilly, I'm asking for the redlist's function to please, please, please be reviewed.

It's just that any IP expenditure is a significant one for a freeman and redlist currently feels very underpowered.