Basic prices

[Puciek]

While I get where you are coming from Puciek, and agree with certain points of what you've said, the fact remains our current market values are based around a system where silver was able to be obtained in abundance. Our currency system is no longer based around that method, and as such the game's economy also needs to have it's rates based on the current system, not based on the prior system. No one's expecting silver to be as devalued as it was previously, but instead seeking it's value to be in line with the current supply and availability of silver. This is a change that will require code and mentality changes.

Also realism is fine and dandy, but this is a game and it's priority should be enjoyment over realism.

But what part of fun does it prohibit? I mean if you want someone without money troubles play gentry, as the very difference between freemen and gentry is the size of bank account. And when weighing silver available I still see, in the limited part of the grid I see, insane sums being tossed around frivolously, so I would say that there is plenty to go around, just have to rp to grab it.

The part where the "Casual" player is at such a disadvantage compared to the players who spend 24+ hours on the game a week. According to activity, the most active player is currently spending more hours on the game than the average 40 hour work week. Now there is nothing wrong with that, don't take this as an attack, but the casual player doesn't typically have the time to grind. I mean even modern games typically have a side system in place for those who just don't have the same time as others to grind. TI doesn't have such a system, as such "intense" grinding shouldn't be the main focus of our systems. Most don't want to spend what limited time they have grinding.

And I have nothing against grinding and putting work towards what you want, I just feel there needs to be a balance. The average player is not going to be keen on spending several OOC months just to afford one costly purchase. They likely already do that enough in real life.

I am surely missing something here, as silver, you get now is passive, and as long as you RP one hour a week you will receive it. Additionally, new players start with 500 silver to get the initial gear, so you do not really have to wait to buy the tools you need. Also as now, there is no conversion between RP to Silver anymore (except for the 1 QP you get for activity list a week) I am not sure what is the grind you are talking about here.

[Voxumo]

I was referring to my Enjoyment over realism comment, moreso than the silver comment.

[Starstarfish]

Additionally, new players start with 500 silver to get the initial gear, so you do not really have to wait to buy the tools you need.

A set of artist's tools for example, currently costs almost 400 silver.

Perhaps one suggestion might be a shop in chargen perhaps where folks can get some of these basic starter tools they'll need to start up with at a reduced price?

[-+[-__-]+-]

I'd like to join the conversation about basic prices, fully understanding that staff is looking into making adjustments to some things already. (Thanks, staff!) For right now though, I'm commenting to alert everyone that I've started separate threads for discussing rumor prices and messenger prices, as I think they should be considered different commodities than general goods and specific trade-related materials.

viewtopic.php?f=28&t=1630 - Messenger Pricing
viewtopic.php?f=28&p=11354#p11354 - Rumor Pricing

[Popcorn]

Additionally, new players start with 500 silver to get the initial gear, so you do not really have to wait to buy the tools you need.

A set of artist's tools for example, currently costs almost 400 silver.

Perhaps one suggestion might be a shop in chargen perhaps where folks can get some of these basic starter tools they'll need to start up with at a reduced price?

The last time I looked, a set of artist's tools was 117 silver. I think the art costs might have already been adjusted when the the crafts were reorganised for better progression.

A lot of tools can also be made by other crafters more cheaply than you can get them from NPC shops, which is a good way for new players to get some interaction.

[Puciek]

Additionally, new players start with 500 silver to get the initial gear, so you do not really have to wait to buy the tools you need.

A set of artist's tools for example, currently costs almost 400 silver.

Perhaps one suggestion might be a shop in chargen perhaps where folks can get some of these basic starter tools they'll need to start up with at a reduced price?

The last time I looked, a set of artist's tools was 117 silver. I think the art costs might have already been adjusted when the the crafts were reorganised for better progression.

A lot of tools can also be made by other crafters more cheaply than you can get them from NPC shops, which is a good way for new players to get some interaction.

Additionally art is really not something freemen would do simply because it's unnecessary and expensive fluff in a world where most people struggled to not starve (with some notable exceptions of that, like a tattooist in a village - but that usually would be a joint effort of the community to set him up with proper tools and those would be passed across for tens of years).

[Starstarfish]

Except TI isn't RL history, it's a separate Universe with its own history and its own stuff so just because whatever was or was not vital in real life does not mean that's how it has to be here. We aren't Medieval Sims MUD.

Also, art for us represents basic stuff like paper making. Which is only as fluffy as it is because the in-game mail system doesn't require actual pieces of paper unless envelopes are going out etc.

[Puciek]

Except TI isn't RL history, it's a separate Universe with its own history and its own stuff so just because whatever was or was not vital in real life does not mean that's how it has to be here. We aren't Medieval Sims MUD.

Also, art for us represents basic stuff like paper making. Which is only as fluffy as it is because the in-game mail system doesn't require actual pieces of paper unless envelopes are going out etc.

I am not sure what is your point here, clean-hand trades, like papercraft and art, are generally gentry, not freeman domain, and with entry price to match it. And then even if the tools were to cost 400 silver (they do not) you can still afford it as a new player, right off the bat.

[Starstarfish]

If that's the intention, we should consider making it more obvious what crafts people should it should not be doing as Gentry or Freeman. I'm not sure the assumptions on what should be done by one vs the other are that clear cut over various helpfiles etc.

[Rabek]

Tattooing, for one, certainly isn't considered high-class by most of the Kingdom, and is covered by art.

That's kind of a silly rationale without any basis in TI theme.

Puciek, please stop presenting your own opinions as facts of TI lore.

It's okay to have opinions, but don't present them as fact. You'll mislead the newbies.