Inactive Players Posting on Forums

[Klapman]

Re: Klapman - I've said this elsewhere, and I'll say it again here - people who have no active characters and come onto our forums to comment are not welcome, particularly if it appears to be an attempt to troll a situation. You haven't logged a character into game for over a month, and you weren't active then either.

1. That's a stupid decision
2. What are you doing
3. Stop

When you become active, we will deem you a player once more, and you'll be welcome to raise your input.

How on earth would you consider that a troll? I've raised good points when I was "deemed" a player, points that you completely ignored in the relevant threads.

http://ti-legacy.com/forums/viewtopic.p ... =30#p10202

http://ti-legacy.com/forums/viewtopic.p ... =30#p10204

And now you have the sheer nerve to imply that I'm a troll? If I was trolling, I wouldn't care about the game. I wouldn't choose a forum that gets less than ten posts a week on average to "troll" in. I've tried being polite and kind while expressing my viewpoints before, and you couldn't even be bothered to throw it back in my face. Or what, are you going to imply that you failed to notice a post that took up half the page? Regardless of whether or not it's an active player, regardless of whether or not they're polite, if their viewpoint disagrees with yours all you can do is try and besmirch their character and try and make them out to be drooling imbeciles in front of everyone else. And if there are no openings, no ways for you to attack, you just ignore them and then lock the thread with vague promises of revisiting the problem some other time.

There's no point in discussing this further. Ban me if you want, delete the post if you want, I've said what I wanted to say.

[Kinaed]

Happy to oblige on that ban request.

I'm hopeful that we can now return to our regularly scheduled programming and the thread topic.

[Percival]

I'm going to say it because I have nothing to lose: Klapman has a valid point about how criticism is received.

Your active playerbase isn't saying anything directly because any time they do they're put onto 'the list' or the player is banned/character deleted.

This results in bad reviews (which in turn have been labelled troll posts).

I too have a vested interest in the game because my friends still play and talk about it. Making a blanket rule about inactive players not posting because you disagree with what is said is fuelling the dissent of the playerbase.

Please ban me too and add to this circus.

[Kinaed]

I see that this isn't going to get back on topic in the short term. Percival, you're not an active player of TI either, so it doesn't surprise me that you feel the need to defend people who aren't active having a voice. That said, I tend to say what I mean, and I've said before - players who are not active and are commenting, particularly if it's in a manner that exacerbates negativity, are not welcome.

Klapman's opinion was expressed rudely and in a manner designed to incite discord - in fact, I'm certain some of his grumpiness is that I used his exact wording back at him for illustrative purposes. When I did, he labelled *me* as besmirching his character - I think he made my point about the rhetoric right there.

Everyone on this forum is capable of deciding what portion of Klapman's commentary was valuable, and if players want to pick it up and discuss his points, they're welcome to. Non-players aren't.

If anyone wants to continue this discussion, please start a new thread. Otherwise, let this one return back to its purpose to discuss the dual guilding change. Further non-thread topics here will result in player warnings.

[Kinaed]

I split out the topic of Inactive Players Posting on Forums for players to discuss as they please because I think the dual guilding discussion thread is important and has gotten hijacked.

Players with thoughts or concerns about inactive players commenting on forum threads can share their thoughts here.

[Taunya]

Klapman's opinion was expressed rudely and in a manner designed to incite discord - in fact, I'm certain some of his grumpiness is that I used his exact wording back at him for illustrative purposes. When I did, he labelled *me* as besmirching his character - I think he made my point about the rhetoric right there.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

I for one welcome inactive/former players to participate in discussions (preferably in a civil manner!). Their insight can be just as valuable.

Without going into it too much, as I've got work in a few minutes, I do agree that the plug is often pulled too quickly on a lot of things. I understand there's contraints on what can be done to remedy situations, but perhaps discussing a guideline on how such things should be handled would help.

And while I don't fear exactly what Percival says, I agree I do sometimes keep my opinion to myself as upsetting the boss is never a good idea.

[Zeita]

When you start a post with 'This is a stupid decision', how is it going to come across as anything but trolling? You only undermine any points that you may subsequently have by taking that sort of approach. I've voiced my disagreement with the staff over decisions in the past, and have never been labelled a troll because I approach the conversation rationally and with respect for the other parties involved and by forming a cogent argument. The other players commenting in the thread that was a precursor to this disagreed with staff weren't labelled with trolling and weren't banned. Why? Because while they spoke vigorously for their points of view, they weren't rude about it- and as current players, they are more invested and have an understandable, real stake in the conversation.

The forum rules are pretty clear, and throwing insults out on the first line is a blatant disregard of that- and what, because you're targetting staff, it doesn't count?

Please just show some common, human decency.

Honestly, with the abuse that staff (a group of volunteers) have received over the years, I have no idea why they continue to run TI- I would have walked away from it years ago if I was in their shoes.

I'm not currently an active player myself due to RL circumstances, but continue to visit the forum because I care for TI, want to see it prosper and certainly intend to play again as time and life allow. Some people only seem to linger to complain, gripe and cause trouble.

At times staff need to make game design decisions for purposes of theme and code corrections- they won't always sit well with everyone, that is the nature of the beast. You either play with those changes or you choose not to and leave, as is your right. Please don't poison the well for those that remain by standing outside and pissing into it.

[Rabek]

Certain members of the staff, who will go unnamed, throw out their own fair share of abuse in turn.

One might consider that the reason some of us don't have active characters anymore is because of the shocking downturn TI has taken the past few years, and those of us who still bother to post here do so out of a sincere hope that TI becomes a place worth playing at once again.

If you want player retention, as was the buzzword not too long ago, you might consider looking at the players who are leaving to solve the problem, rather than refusing to listen.

[Geras]

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[Voxumo]

If you want to see a change in something, you don't abandon it and talk down about it from the sidelines. If you aren't actively playing the game, you aren't as aware of the events or atmosphere of the game that might have brought upon a change.

I've rather disliked the turn TI has taken in recent years, and I've made my view known many times. If you want to see change in the game, you have to be that change. It's why I stick around despite dreading logging into the game at times.

And I've got to echo Zeita here. Staff don't silence anyone who disagrees, it's all about how you present your argument.