RPI = No OOC
In my time on MUDs without OOC communications or when TI didn't have it, I felt very isolated. It felt like the OOC communication was still going on, but it was relegated only to those people who already had other methods of communication, IMs, email, whatnot.
Yes, the OOC community is very important to me. I think the player with issues was having trouble with people misusing tells, and we should focus on addressing those misuses. I was on TI when it didn't have OOC communication, and the feelings of being isolated and left out... it was not great, to say the least. Moreover, a lot of bad things happened to my chracter because I was a stupid 16 year old who didn't get the theme and couldn't really make that clear (e.g., punished for heresy because of misunderstanding the meaning of a brand).
I'm going to politely disagree with you about the rewind, Pixie, although I am very sorry a lot of the anguish seems to have been wrongly directed at you. This is clearly a discussion we need to have, although it should probably be framed in a different way.
If people are misusing tells and OOC channels, it is actually all our responsibility as players to check this behaviour and gently police ourselves and others. Staff can't do it for us, and if it comes down to a point where people are abusing the system/cheating, we're the ones putting them in a situation where they have to consider closing off the OOC means of communication, because there is actually nothing else they can do.
Clearly, judging from the strength of the reaction, no one wants this. I actually think it is important for players to speak up, like you did, when faced with these kinds of problems, and I find it is a lot more telling of other players that they would come down on you for expressing genuine concern for a situation which is actually problematic.
We aren't children. We should be able to speak together about solutions and not fly into an apoplectic rage when something is discussed which we don't like; Kinaed didn't immediately order all OOC channels suspended, which she could have; she floated the idea because it could be a solution to the problem presented. That doesn't mean it has to happen.
It wouldn't need to happen at all if we felt habilitated to actually speak up with concerns, like Pixie did, without fear of everyone ramming back into us for some imagined slight. If we can't police ourselves without throwing tantrums, then yeah, staff has to take things away from us, because we clearly can't be trusted.
If people are misusing tells and OOC channels, it is actually all our responsibility as players to check this behaviour and gently police ourselves and others. Staff can't do it for us, and if it comes down to a point where people are abusing the system/cheating, we're the ones putting them in a situation where they have to consider closing off the OOC means of communication, because there is actually nothing else they can do.
Clearly, judging from the strength of the reaction, no one wants this. I actually think it is important for players to speak up, like you did, when faced with these kinds of problems, and I find it is a lot more telling of other players that they would come down on you for expressing genuine concern for a situation which is actually problematic.
We aren't children. We should be able to speak together about solutions and not fly into an apoplectic rage when something is discussed which we don't like; Kinaed didn't immediately order all OOC channels suspended, which she could have; she floated the idea because it could be a solution to the problem presented. That doesn't mean it has to happen.
It wouldn't need to happen at all if we felt habilitated to actually speak up with concerns, like Pixie did, without fear of everyone ramming back into us for some imagined slight. If we can't police ourselves without throwing tantrums, then yeah, staff has to take things away from us, because we clearly can't be trusted.
I want to second Limonade's point; I don't blame you at ALL, Pixie, and I think you've brought some really important issues to the forefront about people misusing OOC channels. Maybe we need to come down on some offenders, maybe we need to just educate everyone more about what's appropriate and what isn't, I can't say I know. But we definitely need to have this conversation!
-
anietzschesweater
- Posts: 5
- Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2015 7:37 pm
I never post on the forum, not my thing -- but I wanted to say something -- it is merely my opinion and I present it only as such.
First of all I think it's really unfortunate how the atmosphere on the game is getting more and more tense. I feel I deal with more OOC frustrations/attacks/criticism than I do IC, either directed at me, or hearing about them from others. Not cool. I don't think removing OOC will help this though. I think that much of the bad atmosphere is OOC but this will only push the problem down to the point it will explode and we won't even know why.
Let me give you an example, that I think is relevant. In our health care system there has long since been an issue with patients put in stretchers in the hallways. Cause of a lot of public dismay. So instead of dealing with the issue (funding, management, etc). They just decided that staff could no long call a hallway a hallway. Patient is in departure A. What's that? You know that long strip of space between rooms... You mean a hallway? No -- Departure A. We no longer have hallways.
Does this solve the problem? Of course not, what it does is it silences people when they have concerns, which to me can have lasting impacts (I won't digress too much here). I think we have issues that need to resolve. I think that OOC channels are a good way to deal with some of the frustrations so that you don't take it out on the person or in the scene.
I also think that the game can at times get very dark (or should), and twisted. It's nice to also know that there is a human side beyond the player. At least for me.
On a simple mechanics level - I cannot count the scenes I've been in when people go idle for long periods of time. I prefer to say something OOC before I walk away IC because sometimes the IC action would have repercussions. However, a person's time should be respected and this happens a lot. I imagine this would get worse if you couldn't clarify it, and thus we'd have to implement some way to manage it.
What I really think is unfortunate is not this topic specifically, but how things have gotten in a general atmospheric sense. What is the solution? Is there a solution? Well... There will always be conflict, all we can hope is to create a level of understanding so people know why there is conflict -- or just know that they will always heard...listened to... Those two things while not always a solution provide enough comfort to weather through most storms.
However, I do remain hopeful, but I'm a bit of an idealist at the worst of times...
First of all I think it's really unfortunate how the atmosphere on the game is getting more and more tense. I feel I deal with more OOC frustrations/attacks/criticism than I do IC, either directed at me, or hearing about them from others. Not cool. I don't think removing OOC will help this though. I think that much of the bad atmosphere is OOC but this will only push the problem down to the point it will explode and we won't even know why.
Let me give you an example, that I think is relevant. In our health care system there has long since been an issue with patients put in stretchers in the hallways. Cause of a lot of public dismay. So instead of dealing with the issue (funding, management, etc). They just decided that staff could no long call a hallway a hallway. Patient is in departure A. What's that? You know that long strip of space between rooms... You mean a hallway? No -- Departure A. We no longer have hallways.
Does this solve the problem? Of course not, what it does is it silences people when they have concerns, which to me can have lasting impacts (I won't digress too much here). I think we have issues that need to resolve. I think that OOC channels are a good way to deal with some of the frustrations so that you don't take it out on the person or in the scene.
I also think that the game can at times get very dark (or should), and twisted. It's nice to also know that there is a human side beyond the player. At least for me.
On a simple mechanics level - I cannot count the scenes I've been in when people go idle for long periods of time. I prefer to say something OOC before I walk away IC because sometimes the IC action would have repercussions. However, a person's time should be respected and this happens a lot. I imagine this would get worse if you couldn't clarify it, and thus we'd have to implement some way to manage it.
What I really think is unfortunate is not this topic specifically, but how things have gotten in a general atmospheric sense. What is the solution? Is there a solution? Well... There will always be conflict, all we can hope is to create a level of understanding so people know why there is conflict -- or just know that they will always heard...listened to... Those two things while not always a solution provide enough comfort to weather through most storms.
However, I do remain hopeful, but I'm a bit of an idealist at the worst of times...
I truly am sorry for being the cause behind ill-feelings. I loathe being that person, and I'm going to try and explain where bringing the topic up actually came from in the interest of furthering the conversation we should be having, instead of the no-OOC conversation. At least, I hope it does!
I can't come up with a valid argument against keeping osay, no matter how jarring it can be sometimes when attempting to do what we're generally here for, which I would hope we can agree is the RP. I just can't... picture any way that not having an osay channel would work out with TI's OOC culture. Lots of successful RPIs have managed it just fine, but they didn't start out with it as an option. I don't think we could adapt to not having it. We're accustomed to using it. It's a very useful tool and it's been incredibly helpful to probably just about everybody at one time or another.
What I'm uncomfortable with is that a fair percentage of scenes these days devolve into an osay chat room, and when asked to cut back on the chatter - at best people don't, at worst they become passively hostile to the person now perceived as ruining their fun. Where this used to be almost inconceivable it's now pretty common. I wouldn't want to see osay completely gone, but some ways it's being used are kind of sucky.
It wasn't considered part of TI's culture to narrate RP or maintain an constant flow of osay chatter, before. If that has changed then it's changed, but is it a change we want? If the answer to that is "yes", okay. I'll adapt. If it's not, we gotta find ways of making that part of the game culture more apparent.
This brings me to my next point of budding "bleh", which is tells. Again, a useful tool, something many RPIs don't have, but TI probably couldn't do without because we're accustomed to usingthem. Tells are super useful, open up avenues for private help, allow friendships to form between players, and without them we would be missing something precious from the game. I've made countless acquaintances and friends on TI over tells, and I wouldn't trade them for anything. I can't complain about organizing future scene meet-ups over tells, either. That's a totally reasonable way to handle different OOC schedules and active times.
What I feel I can complain about is that somewhere in the semi-recent past tells have become a prerequisite to poses and a source of IC discussion, pressure, and explanation. I don't want to know why your character made that expression or be asked OOCly to explain to you how my character is feeling after yours said X or Y. I don't want to be inadvertently swayed to take or not take certain IC actions over tells because your character -actually- meant THIS when he said or did the previous. I definitely don't want a string of kinda hostile OOC commentary because my character is behaving in a way you don't understand. This has become pretty prevalent. Prevalent enough that Staff intervention and punishment almost seems like it's being perceived as a speed bump, rather than a legitimate deterrent.
As far as the OOC channel itself goes, I've never had an issue with it. In and of itself it's never been perceived, as far as I can tell, as a place to badger anyone about anything even remotely IC-related. It's fun and it's community-healthy. When I mentioned the OOC channels' removal, I believe I specified not the actual OOC channel, and if I didn't I should have. I was referring to tells and osay only, which I've explained above. I have to admit it wouldn't really work. I just have some real issues with their present use.
I love TI for the RP -and- the community. I don't love it for certain aspects of the community that have felt, to me, as if they're getting unhealthy.
And that is the end of my speech(es).
I can't come up with a valid argument against keeping osay, no matter how jarring it can be sometimes when attempting to do what we're generally here for, which I would hope we can agree is the RP. I just can't... picture any way that not having an osay channel would work out with TI's OOC culture. Lots of successful RPIs have managed it just fine, but they didn't start out with it as an option. I don't think we could adapt to not having it. We're accustomed to using it. It's a very useful tool and it's been incredibly helpful to probably just about everybody at one time or another.
What I'm uncomfortable with is that a fair percentage of scenes these days devolve into an osay chat room, and when asked to cut back on the chatter - at best people don't, at worst they become passively hostile to the person now perceived as ruining their fun. Where this used to be almost inconceivable it's now pretty common. I wouldn't want to see osay completely gone, but some ways it's being used are kind of sucky.
It wasn't considered part of TI's culture to narrate RP or maintain an constant flow of osay chatter, before. If that has changed then it's changed, but is it a change we want? If the answer to that is "yes", okay. I'll adapt. If it's not, we gotta find ways of making that part of the game culture more apparent.
This brings me to my next point of budding "bleh", which is tells. Again, a useful tool, something many RPIs don't have, but TI probably couldn't do without because we're accustomed to usingthem. Tells are super useful, open up avenues for private help, allow friendships to form between players, and without them we would be missing something precious from the game. I've made countless acquaintances and friends on TI over tells, and I wouldn't trade them for anything. I can't complain about organizing future scene meet-ups over tells, either. That's a totally reasonable way to handle different OOC schedules and active times.
What I feel I can complain about is that somewhere in the semi-recent past tells have become a prerequisite to poses and a source of IC discussion, pressure, and explanation. I don't want to know why your character made that expression or be asked OOCly to explain to you how my character is feeling after yours said X or Y. I don't want to be inadvertently swayed to take or not take certain IC actions over tells because your character -actually- meant THIS when he said or did the previous. I definitely don't want a string of kinda hostile OOC commentary because my character is behaving in a way you don't understand. This has become pretty prevalent. Prevalent enough that Staff intervention and punishment almost seems like it's being perceived as a speed bump, rather than a legitimate deterrent.
As far as the OOC channel itself goes, I've never had an issue with it. In and of itself it's never been perceived, as far as I can tell, as a place to badger anyone about anything even remotely IC-related. It's fun and it's community-healthy. When I mentioned the OOC channels' removal, I believe I specified not the actual OOC channel, and if I didn't I should have. I was referring to tells and osay only, which I've explained above. I have to admit it wouldn't really work. I just have some real issues with their present use.
I love TI for the RP -and- the community. I don't love it for certain aspects of the community that have felt, to me, as if they're getting unhealthy.
And that is the end of my speech(es).
Last edited by Pixie on Sun Feb 14, 2016 7:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I'm actually a very low-OOC-interaction player. I'm here to RP and immerse myself in the game world, so I prefer VERY FEW osays in scenes (more often than not, I'm the grouchy person telling everyone else to use them sparingly, especially when it comes to banter). I also NEVER use the OOC channel, but I rely pretty heavily on tells to touch base with fun/intelligent people I care about, offer helpful private advice to new players without spamming everyone else, and other such things that make the game more convenient to play. AFAIK, both tells and the OOC channel are completely optional and can be disabled by players at any time.
I do consider most OOC communication to be a privilege, however, and not a right. If people are found to be abusing it, those individuals should have their privileges revoked. The IC/OOC line can be a difficult one to keep sight of at times, but every player should be vigilant about crossover and sensitive toward the climate of the game and how their OOC communication (e.g. bitching, gossip) might impact the community as a whole. Encourage your fellow players to find more constructive ways to air their grievances.
As for other games, I've played some that don't allow private OOC communication (Sindome, for example), I didn't really find them to be more immersive -- just more inconvenient. Also, what happens in these games is that people find ways to exchange contact information (Skype, AIM, Hangouts, whatever) in order to be able to talk privately outside of the game instead. IMO, it's better to keep the communication in-game, where it can potentially be logged and reviewed in cases of alleged abuse, harassment, or collusion.
I do consider most OOC communication to be a privilege, however, and not a right. If people are found to be abusing it, those individuals should have their privileges revoked. The IC/OOC line can be a difficult one to keep sight of at times, but every player should be vigilant about crossover and sensitive toward the climate of the game and how their OOC communication (e.g. bitching, gossip) might impact the community as a whole. Encourage your fellow players to find more constructive ways to air their grievances.
As for other games, I've played some that don't allow private OOC communication (Sindome, for example), I didn't really find them to be more immersive -- just more inconvenient. Also, what happens in these games is that people find ways to exchange contact information (Skype, AIM, Hangouts, whatever) in order to be able to talk privately outside of the game instead. IMO, it's better to keep the communication in-game, where it can potentially be logged and reviewed in cases of alleged abuse, harassment, or collusion.
-- player of Jules and others
Copy from the general board to centralize discussion:
[ #21 ] General Board
A note has been posted by: Orlando
From room : 3002
In subject of: OOC? (Edited by Orlando) (Edited by Silrie) (Edited by Toroni) (Edited by Basil) (Edited by Aios) (Edited by Temi)
Date : Sun Feb 14 03:19:24 2016
Expires : Sat Mar 5 03:19:30 2016
To : all
_________________________________________________________________________
A friend just told me there was actually a debate concerning removing
the OOC channel from this game. So, I'd like to offer my sentiments --
because, like the majority of players here, I simply don't use forums. Let
me offer the bottom line up front: please don't kill what's left of the
deteriorating aspect of community here, because the "game" isn't compelling
enough to robustly stand alone (and, for sure, no MUD is).
Forgive the allusion to GOP presidential candidates, but: I remember 9/11
acutely, and how the previous implementor talked everyone, myself included,
through it. I remember making connections with countless people throughout
the past decade; one still plays here, and countless others don't. But
still, they exist: and one connection, galvanized through OOC contact, got
me through my time in Afghanistan.
Anyway, I'm troubled by the *lack* of OOC participation rather than its
inclusion. This is, at its core, a frivolous game where we pretend to
fight wizards. But we're all like-minded enough to enjoy it. Just today,
I had a scintillating conversation about -- wait for it -- cooking steak.
It felt, for a moment there, like old TI. Not the TI that exists now,
where I log in, type whererp, and see a string of 1s and 2s, and where
there's 4 people on OOC out of the 25 logged in. That may be healthy for
the game, but it's not healthy for the community.
Over the years, I've made several friends on TI. And, honestly, I hope you
can too! Please don't kill your chances by destroying the opportunity to
get to know each other as people.
-Chris
Silrie: I agree with Lando here. I think that instead of removing ooc
communication completely, a command other than whoinvis should be
implemented for those who just don't want any ooc contact with their fellow
players whatsoever. But I have made several dear friends here, and I feel
that ooc communication is helping me make yet another. I had a long ooc
conversation with a fellow player the other day which really helped me
hammer out a character concept, and I've found ooc communication can also
be used to inquire if someone is available to rp as well as to speak about
tensions ooc players might be having with one another.
On a level of pure assistance, relationships aside, as a blind player, I
have often used tells to send color strings to my sighted friends for their
visual advice. I've also sent them to myself to make certain they've been
formatted properly. Tells, when used right, can be useful. And on a game
where, depending on the character, it sometimes feels like half the
characters want you dead and half just think you're trash, having that ooc
feeling of comradery, for those who do not mind extending that through
tells, can be a real comfort.
Removing tells also removes a newbie's ability to quickly and privately ask
older players for support. I've been guided through a lot via tells. And
before you guys say, just use personal boards, here's the truth of the
matter. The problem isn't having the channels. It's those who abuse them,
and if people are abusing them, they're going to abuse the personal board
if tells are removed, so the problem isn't being fixed, it's merely being
shifted. And if personal boards are removed, well, that's just a whole
other level of issue. But as I doubt that would happen since it's so
integral to passing information at times, my former words still stand. The
problem does not generate with the channels, but their abusers.
If you guys haven't voted, please, vote for your opinion here. This
discussion, I think, is just us trying to support our own opinions on the
subject, and, well, I've spoken mine.
viewtopic.php? F=8&t=1204&p=7675
toroni. Honestly, I don't have a forum account, but I did want to put my
two sense in here. No, I do not believe removing ooc chanals are a good
thing. I can understand why some might consider it, but I have not only
found ti to be a solid place for rp, but I have made some genuin friends,
and yes, at times, have received help trying to work out the commands for
this, that, or the other. Are their risks in keeping it open, sure. Have
I at times said things I didn't mean, yep. But you know what, ti is more
than just a game, its a family I've met some honest people here, and I
agree with silrie, and lando here. Thanks, tor
TI is a very immersive experience, yes, and I love that. It's part of why
I came and and stayed and got involved. I can see why some people would
want to ignore the other humans behind the characters they play with,
especially if they are afraid it will only lead to tension. But as someone
who loves collaborative storytelling, and who has done a lot of it, I know
that such *REQUIRES* OOC communication. The OOC channel helps people not
only communicate as players, but as individuals and friends, so that people
feel comfortable asking for help and advice, as well as being able to
discuss plot and character development. So, I entirely agree with Lando.
Communication is key! Chuckabeth
Aios: So I was not at the OOC chat, but the actual poll on this topic says
that players suggested this, not imms. Kinaed's whole point of putting up
the poll (again, according to the actual words in the forums post) are that
the pbase in general is probably against it, but she wanted to poll to see.
I know not everyone has a forums account, but you don't need one to read
the thread. So even if you want to reply here instead of there, I strongly
suggest that you catch up on the actual discussion rather than assume that
imms are trying to murder all of humanity or whatever, especially since it
seems that it's the player community who brought up the topic in the first
place. Also note I'm not even weighing in on one side or the other, I just
hate to see such sudden anger arise from people simply not being in the
right discussion. Peace.
Temi - We appreciate everyone having opinions and that this is important to
you, but I would like to ask that we have these discussions on the forum
post so that all of the arguments are centralized. I will copy-paste these
comments over there, and will request that people don't keep responding
here. If anyone needs help with forum access, please let us know and we
will see what we can do to address your issues.
[ #21 ] General Board
A note has been posted by: Orlando
From room : 3002
In subject of: OOC? (Edited by Orlando) (Edited by Silrie) (Edited by Toroni) (Edited by Basil) (Edited by Aios) (Edited by Temi)
Date : Sun Feb 14 03:19:24 2016
Expires : Sat Mar 5 03:19:30 2016
To : all
_________________________________________________________________________
A friend just told me there was actually a debate concerning removing
the OOC channel from this game. So, I'd like to offer my sentiments --
because, like the majority of players here, I simply don't use forums. Let
me offer the bottom line up front: please don't kill what's left of the
deteriorating aspect of community here, because the "game" isn't compelling
enough to robustly stand alone (and, for sure, no MUD is).
Forgive the allusion to GOP presidential candidates, but: I remember 9/11
acutely, and how the previous implementor talked everyone, myself included,
through it. I remember making connections with countless people throughout
the past decade; one still plays here, and countless others don't. But
still, they exist: and one connection, galvanized through OOC contact, got
me through my time in Afghanistan.
Anyway, I'm troubled by the *lack* of OOC participation rather than its
inclusion. This is, at its core, a frivolous game where we pretend to
fight wizards. But we're all like-minded enough to enjoy it. Just today,
I had a scintillating conversation about -- wait for it -- cooking steak.
It felt, for a moment there, like old TI. Not the TI that exists now,
where I log in, type whererp, and see a string of 1s and 2s, and where
there's 4 people on OOC out of the 25 logged in. That may be healthy for
the game, but it's not healthy for the community.
Over the years, I've made several friends on TI. And, honestly, I hope you
can too! Please don't kill your chances by destroying the opportunity to
get to know each other as people.
-Chris
Silrie: I agree with Lando here. I think that instead of removing ooc
communication completely, a command other than whoinvis should be
implemented for those who just don't want any ooc contact with their fellow
players whatsoever. But I have made several dear friends here, and I feel
that ooc communication is helping me make yet another. I had a long ooc
conversation with a fellow player the other day which really helped me
hammer out a character concept, and I've found ooc communication can also
be used to inquire if someone is available to rp as well as to speak about
tensions ooc players might be having with one another.
On a level of pure assistance, relationships aside, as a blind player, I
have often used tells to send color strings to my sighted friends for their
visual advice. I've also sent them to myself to make certain they've been
formatted properly. Tells, when used right, can be useful. And on a game
where, depending on the character, it sometimes feels like half the
characters want you dead and half just think you're trash, having that ooc
feeling of comradery, for those who do not mind extending that through
tells, can be a real comfort.
Removing tells also removes a newbie's ability to quickly and privately ask
older players for support. I've been guided through a lot via tells. And
before you guys say, just use personal boards, here's the truth of the
matter. The problem isn't having the channels. It's those who abuse them,
and if people are abusing them, they're going to abuse the personal board
if tells are removed, so the problem isn't being fixed, it's merely being
shifted. And if personal boards are removed, well, that's just a whole
other level of issue. But as I doubt that would happen since it's so
integral to passing information at times, my former words still stand. The
problem does not generate with the channels, but their abusers.
If you guys haven't voted, please, vote for your opinion here. This
discussion, I think, is just us trying to support our own opinions on the
subject, and, well, I've spoken mine.
viewtopic.php? F=8&t=1204&p=7675
toroni. Honestly, I don't have a forum account, but I did want to put my
two sense in here. No, I do not believe removing ooc chanals are a good
thing. I can understand why some might consider it, but I have not only
found ti to be a solid place for rp, but I have made some genuin friends,
and yes, at times, have received help trying to work out the commands for
this, that, or the other. Are their risks in keeping it open, sure. Have
I at times said things I didn't mean, yep. But you know what, ti is more
than just a game, its a family I've met some honest people here, and I
agree with silrie, and lando here. Thanks, tor
TI is a very immersive experience, yes, and I love that. It's part of why
I came and and stayed and got involved. I can see why some people would
want to ignore the other humans behind the characters they play with,
especially if they are afraid it will only lead to tension. But as someone
who loves collaborative storytelling, and who has done a lot of it, I know
that such *REQUIRES* OOC communication. The OOC channel helps people not
only communicate as players, but as individuals and friends, so that people
feel comfortable asking for help and advice, as well as being able to
discuss plot and character development. So, I entirely agree with Lando.
Communication is key! Chuckabeth
Aios: So I was not at the OOC chat, but the actual poll on this topic says
that players suggested this, not imms. Kinaed's whole point of putting up
the poll (again, according to the actual words in the forums post) are that
the pbase in general is probably against it, but she wanted to poll to see.
I know not everyone has a forums account, but you don't need one to read
the thread. So even if you want to reply here instead of there, I strongly
suggest that you catch up on the actual discussion rather than assume that
imms are trying to murder all of humanity or whatever, especially since it
seems that it's the player community who brought up the topic in the first
place. Also note I'm not even weighing in on one side or the other, I just
hate to see such sudden anger arise from people simply not being in the
right discussion. Peace.
Temi - We appreciate everyone having opinions and that this is important to
you, but I would like to ask that we have these discussions on the forum
post so that all of the arguments are centralized. I will copy-paste these
comments over there, and will request that people don't keep responding
here. If anyone needs help with forum access, please let us know and we
will see what we can do to address your issues.
-
Chuckabeth
- Posts: 13
- Joined: Sun Nov 22, 2015 4:24 pm
- Location: Western desert of the US
Hi! So I just want to apologize if any of my comments seem angry. 
That is not intended. I state my opinions candidly, and I'm not afraid to - and that might be something I need to work on. (Especially since I'm often far too hasty about it.) But please know that I value everyone's opinions and points of view! I don't want anyone to think I'm yelling at them or judging them, ever... I truly value good and thoughtful criticism and debate, so I apologize for my over-zealousness!
That is not intended. I state my opinions candidly, and I'm not afraid to - and that might be something I need to work on. (Especially since I'm often far too hasty about it.) But please know that I value everyone's opinions and points of view! I don't want anyone to think I'm yelling at them or judging them, ever... I truly value good and thoughtful criticism and debate, so I apologize for my over-zealousness!-
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