[Poll] Rumors

[Klapman]

Personally I've been writing a lot of rumors about my own character, half as practice for getting into the world, and half to provide little RP hooks for people. In that sense, it's been very useful to me - but I do understand that that situation is rather rare. The thread that Pixie linked to seems like a good way of handling it - inflammatory, 'emotion-based' rumors are best sent from PCs, while NPC ones should just be 'hello this is what happened, how do you feel about this, common bargoer'. A little more beep boop so that you know it's more or less a status update rather than something you might want to follow up on IC cause you think it'll be interesting. I can certainly see how that'd be offputting, trying to hunt down the source of a rumor only to find that it's Lithmorran Citizen #83,927 instead of someone your character is actually in a pissing match with.

[Tremere]

I would also point out that when you put up a rumor there is a source option. I agree that general reporting on incidents should be bypstanders, but if you are injecting your personal view into it you should take responsability. If we have no way to react to the emote other than to maybe occasionally witch at it, then what's the point of having the source there at all? Being able to rpa searching out who started the rumor would -add- rp. All it is now is a perfect anonymous way to sling mud and because it is perfectly anonymous it deinsentivises you to deal with it. Might as well just quash it with ip or just ignore it. And I don't see how that really adds much to the rp. I also agree with Pixie that general rumors probably a bit harder, but circles should be easier. Still think it should at -least- be possible.

[Kinaed]

I think the staff stance on rumors is stated in our HELP POLICY RUMORS.

The vote seemed about half and half regarding how people feel about it. Generally speaking, we don't think it should be possible to trace a rumor to its source given how hard it is IRL, and also that we don't actually force people to be the ones spreading gossip, only that when they provide it to the rumor mill, that they do so in a manner where it really could have originated from that source. If people are RPing at court, for example, it's perfectly reasonable for a courtier to overhear and become the source of the rumor rather than the player who is OOCly helping us fulfill the environment.

[Pixie]

Right, but the courtier who started the rumor still heard it from a player in that example, and through any number of methods could be compelled to tell you who they overheard saying it. That's where it being flat out impossible becomes difficult, logic-wise.

[Tremere]

Right, but the courtier who started the rumor still heard it from a player in that example, and through any number of methods could be compelled to tell you who they overheard saying it. That's where it being flat out impossible becomes difficult, logic-wise.

+1. Plus in game you can use a lot more methods that you wouldn't necessarily do IRL. And IRL it's still possible to find out the source of rumors about you in your circle.

[Voxumo]

But by the time you hear the rumor, how many other paths has it taken? Rumors aren't just A to B to C to D, it's more like A to C, C to F and G, G to B and B2, F back to A and Z. Rumors in real life are not easily traceable, and there is no reason they should be in game. If you want to have revenge against a rumor spreading against you, use methods that are in your power, instead of relying on staff to take away all the work for you and just give the answer.

You talk about creating rp, but having staff rpa it for you takes away from the 'searching and deduction' rp that could have been, rp which gets more people involved than just the originator and topic of the rumor, and it only creates confrontational rp with the original spreader of the rumor getting the short end of the stick.

[Pixie]

I haven't seen a single person claiming it should be easy to trace a rumor's source. What's actually being said is that it should be hard, but possible. This is just repeating myself at this point, but again: Not easy, possible.

[Dice]

RPA exists to enable things that are ICly possible but not codewise doable without staff. Given as the rumor system works through NPCs and not PCs, it should be ICly possible to backtrack a rumor, but it is not codewise doable without staff. This should be a no-brainer. You literally cannot search and deduce when rumors are typically spread without a single other PC's input beside the actual rumor-creator.

But I'm also of the opinion we should force people to ICly be responsible for their rumors if they're slagging people off, so...

[Limonade]

I am on the fence about rumour responsibility. While I try to get things attributed to my PC or close-enough-to-my-PC, I don't think it's a thing we should enforce (I am fine with the risk; other players may not be); there are perfectly legitimate times where rumours are relevant and shouldn't be traceable to your PC. For example, (and with OOC disclosure) I am behind some of the song-rumours we had a small while back, but honestly I wouldn't find it fitting for my PC to be the source (ie: who people would be able to pinpoint as someone who originated the song live, because she evidently doesn't sing in pubs); I then made my sources 'Tavern/Court bard X,Y,Z, as paid off/under instructions/insert other reasoning by Ofelia.' I think it's perfectly reasonable or it to be difficult-to-impossible to pinpoint rumour origin, because I am honestly not very fond into the game of whack-a-mole that sort of search has a tendency of turning into. (Mind you she -could- have been find out, but I think it's appropriate, given the means taken, that it would have been a costly and time-consuming endeavour - ie: not worth it.)

The plain truth is I don't think rumours should be conflict in and of themselves and that they should be used more as RP prompts than an ordained mission to find out who said something mean about you behind your back. (I honestly find it super thematically jarring for people to hunt down rumour sources, I cannot conceive of nobles who would care -that- much. Honestly, you get to laugh yourself to your country estate while whoever said something mean is probably eating from a trough; this 100% blows my mind.)

Besides that, though, I find it to be a dangerous assumption that any player owes any other player anything (if anything because that is -never- balanced). I think it's wrong to demand that players pay a toll for shit disturbing because... why exactly? If you don't like the rumour, have the Troubs tank it into oblivion and then be done with it; that way the person doesn't get to laugh in their beard about how they are victorious when it just pops out of existence as soon as it was born. We have very real ways of regulating the news cycle and they are woefully underused (we were -just- talking about how Troub RP can kind of suck; this is exactly what they should be doing).

What I am long-windedly trying to say, really, is that we all have different ideas of what makes compelling play, and somewhere that has to be fine. I am aware that there are plenty of things I personally find fun are not for other players and I think that showing one another that same courtesy in return will go a long way in helping us play together.

[Azarial]

Somehow I missed this; I'd like to add a vote for 'no, the rumor mill is great, vicious is part of rumors, like hollywood tabloids'.