The Uncertain future of the Physicians

[Voxumo]

With the changes to herbalism, this leads to an uncertain future for the Physicians guild. You want to know why I make such a drastic comment? Because physician rp sucks... It sucks the greatest of any rp I've had the fortune of playing, and I've played a little bit of everything, minus merchants, because I can't string well to save my life.

Physician rp typically comes down to this. You wait in the triage for hours on end, nobody comes... then as soon as you decide to log off everyone and their brother get's injured, and you get bitched at for not being around. And let's say you do get to treat somebody, as soon as you are done treating them, they typically get the hell out of there as quickly as possible. It's very, very rarely we get people who want to actually stick around and rp with physicians. I've had more rp from people who come into the triage just to shoot the breeze because they saw me on where for hours on end, and thought I might enjoy some interaction.

Furthermore it makes no sense that joe blow would know how to make poisons... Poisons often follow the exact same logic as medicine, but in reverse. They target the humors negatively, they are meant to upset the humors. They are the Anti to the Medicines. Even the brotherhood has one less draw to them now, as herbalism was also their guild skill. Only difference is they got completely shafted in this whole ordeal.

But most importantly this change has taken the one bit of leverage the physicians had. The one thing that gave us any bit of authority. Any bit of power we could loom over others. Every guild has a little bit of authority they can loom over others. The physicians have nothing, because you don't even have to have medicine over 36 to treat wounds. It may take longer than a mastered physician, but it's doable. There is no reason to join the physicians any longer. The change hasn't even balanced the game at all. No one buys bouquets, no one buys what could be considered floristry items. Now with chandlers having easy access to herbalism and the oils that come with it, there is no reason for a floristry shop to exist. You've cut out anyone who tries to play a florist, as the oils necessary for such high-tier chandlery items were the only thing that were profitable to sell.


Also staff, if you are going to make such a drastic change, at least provide an ic reason. You can't just change people's rp in such a significant way without giving us something to go on. And the excuse used for whenever a spell in magic changes isn't going to cut it here.

[Taunya]

I like the split personally, but it does need some balancing still I think.

I agree the poisons probably should have gone with it, for the reasons stated. Medical knowledge would include knowledge of drugs negative as well as positive. Some of the more fun recreational drugs too perhaps, though simple things like tabac, coamjar, floleaf and the like should stay with herbalism.

Perhaps the brotherhood could have medicine as well. Back alley doctors seem a likely thing anyway, but primarily for restriction of poisons and hard drugs to Farmer Joe, while still giving access to them to a few people outside of the Physicians.

[Voxumo]

Perhaps the brotherhood could have medicine as well. Back alley doctors seem a likely thing anyway, but primarily for restriction of poisons and hard drugs to Farmer Joe, while still giving access to them to a few people outside of the Physicians.

Then why even have the physicians? Medicine is the only gimmick the physicians have going for them. The brotherhood has Lockpicking, Forgery, if that's even a skill still, and I think they have a few others.

Truthfully if injuries were not as debilitating as they are now, I'd say it would be better to kill off the physicians as a guild. Though at least with wounds and injuries the way they are, there is some small need.




I'm also just sick and tired of merchants complaining, when they have the most lucrative set of guildskills. No other guild has guildskils that quite compare to the variety, and usefulness the merchants have. Sure the troubadours have a ton of guildskills, but their skills just... there's a reason hardly anybody plays a troubadour, and that the guild is on life support. Everybody purchases clothing and weapons... not everybody cares to listen to a bard improvise music. We really shouldn't be giving the merchants more shit to make their field easier.

I also really wish this was an ic change somehow, as I'd be all on board organizing a physician strike in protest of this. But alas I'm not going to pull an ic stunt in response to an ooc change, but it sure is tempting.

[Taunya]

I don't think giving medicine to the brotherhood would hurt the physicians more than it already is. No one's going to go into Southside looking for a shadow doctor when they get hurt, unless they have strong reason to. And the two combat-heavy guilds can't join them anyway, if you're thinking in terms of medical rp avoidance. Unlike the physicians, there's no leaving the Brotherhood alive once they're in, so I doubt most other combat characters would try joining just to learn how to heal themselves.

[Voxumo]

I don't think giving medicine to the brotherhood would hurt the physicians more than it already is. No one's going to go into Southside looking for a shadow doctor when they get hurt, unless they have strong reason to. And the two combat-heavy guilds can't join them anyway, if you're thinking in terms of medical rp avoidance. Unlike the physicians, there's no leaving the Brotherhood alive once they're in, so I doubt most other combat characters would try joining just to learn how to heal themselves.

True, though you don't really need to increase medicine past 36 to treat wounds. So as long as you're able to get one rank in medicine, it negates the need to join a guild. As I said it makes it easier, but that's about all.

[Kinaed]

I've been alerted to this post and have decided not to respond to most of it as unnecessary vitroil.

Staff have decided to compensate any physicians eho had a high herbalism skill and have lost craft recipes. Just drop us a Request Board post.

Voxumo, please consider apologizing to both players and staff for the unnecessary vitroil. Your opinion is fine, but there is no reason to coach it in language that makes it both hard and discouraging to read. Thank you.

[Voxumo]

I've been alerted to this post and have decided not to respond to most of it as unnecessary vitroil.

Staff have decided to compensate any physicians eho had a high herbalism skill and have lost craft recipes. Just drop us a Request Board post.

Voxumo, please consider apologizing to both players and staff for the unnecessary vitroil. Your opinion is fine, but there is no reason to coach it in language that makes it both hard and discouraging to read. Thank you.

There will be no apology. I've already edited out some of the unnecessary language that was added in when it was originally written in anger. If talking about how physician rp sucks is "Hard" to read, then why are you even playing this game or being an involved part in it?

My anger is justified, as this change has not only affected the physicians harshly, it's also undone at least two weeks of rp that has been initiated by Nadya and Myself.

It just feels like staff don't care about the physicians.. And to be fair, we've always just been a side project.

[Puciek]

Biting aside (but I will yield that the tone was a bit unpleasant to read), I want to propose a small hypothetical food for thought.

Let's say that tomorrow medicine outside of physicians guild doesn't work, simply if you are not a physician, you can't do it. Additionally, to have medicine at any level beyond 0 in chargen requires an application.

Does that improve the game for the physicians or the player base as a whole? Or would that make it worse than it is, causing a hurt to the overall player base?
How about if the physicians were removed, and would just be a free-floating skill, does that improve or take away from the game? How?

[Voxumo]

Biting aside (but I will yield that the tone was a bit unpleasant to read), I want to propose a small hypothetical food for thought.

Let's say that tomorrow medicine outside of physicians guild doesn't work, simply if you are not a physician, you can't do it. Additionally, to have medicine at any level beyond 0 in chargen requires an application.

Does that improve the game for the physicians or the player base as a whole? Or would that make it worse than it is, causing a hurt to the overall player base?
How about if the physicians were removed, and would just be a free-floating skill, does that improve or take away from the game? How?

I'm not quite sure what point you are trying to make. I do not see limiting medicine to applications to be helpful, But that isn't what was happening with herbalism. It could be bought up to 36 in chargen, and that allows you to tend to most plants a common joe would have access to. Plants like Vanilla, cinnamon, pomegranate, saffron, temijul etc are not plants a common person would likely see in their lifetime. Orchids alone are very finicky plants that can't be treated like every other plant. I say this from experience as I grew up with a mother who loved orchids, and had many variations of orchids. Never Vanilla orchid even though she desperately wanted one, but I can only assume it would be just as finicky.

And if memory serves me right, Medicine was at one time a free-floating skill. It has been many years but I remember the game when it didn't have a physician guild, though injuries still existed, and I'm pretty sure there was a skill for treating wounds. I can't remember how well the game functioned then, but it didn't seem like it was on the verge of anarchy.

And I'll be honest, when i first joined the physicians on this character, I did so just for herbalism. I had no interest in getting involved in medicine as I've been there, done that. I was prepared to skip out on the physicians as soon as I mastered herbalism. But after spending a decent amount of time in the physicians, I changed my tune. I was one of those people I now despise.


However, I have edited the first post a bit. I've removed/changed a few parts I felt might have been viewed as bitey, but unless someone points out to me a section, it looks fine to me.

[Starstarfish]

Physician rp typically comes down to this. You wait in the triage for hours on end, nobody comes... then as soon as you decide to log off everyone and their brother get's injured, and you get bitched at for not being around.

This honestly isn't a whole lot different than being an Orderite. Mage attacks et al happen when you aren't on and then people use that as a reason to RP that you aren't doing your job. So regardless of how skills are or are not arranged, this will still be a thing. People like to weirdly RP about how you literally not being logged in means you aren't doing your IC job. Which is meta as all get out.

Maybe in the end the solution isn't waiting around in one room for hours hoping people come talk to you? That doesn't work for any Guild or role again, regardless of skill set-up.

In the end, we needed to separate in some way caring for plants from knowing about medicines and from knowing about perfumes. They are linked yet separate branches of knowledge.

Also, the comment was made in at least one past OOC meeting that the old set-up was highly abusable. So if that's true, it needed addressing.

In the end, we need people in roles IC because frankly, they like them, not because of l33t skills. This is an RP-focused game, people need to enjoy the RP of the role they are in. Not having this OOC idea that we need to keep other Guilds from getting something or not getting something.