Basic prices

[Puciek]

Tattooing, for one, certainly isn't considered high-class by most of the Kingdom, and is covered by art.

That's kind of a silly rationale without any basis in TI theme.

Puciek, please stop presenting your own opinions as facts of TI lore.

It's okay to have opinions, but don't present them as fact. You'll mislead the newbies.

Now go and actually read my post because I even used the exact same example as you did - tattoos.

[chronodbu]

Also realism is fine and dandy, but this is a game and it's priority should be enjoyment over realism.

This. A thousand times this. I'm not playing this game for hyperrealistic hard times with money. I've got enough of that kind of trouble IRL. The balance needs to be stricken between reasonably difficult for certain classes and fun, not "this is how it was in this time period".

[Evrald]

I personally believe that the easiest solution for this would be to reinstate the Purchase Silver through use of XP.

As it stands right now, if you start out you have 500 silver as a Freemen, you get a T1 asset for free, and if you didn't/don't buy a T2 asset in Chargen, then you officially get 75 silver a week. to go with the 500 you had before. Spending money to make money is nice and all but it relies on people to actually need the item you're selling because now that you can't purchase silver, you have to take up crafting and sell items and hope people buy them or wait for several weeks to finally get enough coin to buy something from someone, or wait for several months to hopefully save up enough money to buy a T2 asset if you didn't before and leave your Cyan period. Those of us who were gone during the time when you could go back and buy a T2 asset for XP or Silver are rather boned in that respect.

As an example, Evrald was gone due to the fact my job at Walmart left me feeling drained and having no time to do anything, I left that job at the beginning of September, and started a new one at the beginning of October that allows me more free time and a more relaxed state of mind, allowing me to kick back and enjoy TI again. But since Evrald was gone for more than a year from actual RP, and the asset system got released in that time and the grace period is gone. People can no longer buy silver. So fast forward to now.

Evrald spends 300 silver to make an item. Taking the hit to his bank account for the hope of making 450 total off of it. The person he sells it to can only afford 325 because the new system doesn't allow for purchase silver w/xp. This means that Evrald makes an item for 300 silver, spends 50-80 MV on the item's creation, and sells it for 325, making a whopping 25 silver profit off of an hour of work and three days of waiting for someone to buy the item. Could he have sold it to someone else who could afford the 450? Sure. But in the new system they are likely to have a lot less in the way of spending coin, so would likely not buy it from him unless it was an actual necessity for them. So now Merchants will be constantly losing money(instead of making it) and have less business overall.

I'm aware that a freemen shouldn't have 10 million gold in the bank and a 10 room wood house with 10 addons per room. However in the Purchase Silver system, unless that freemen is dedicating all of their time to RP'ing and spending XP on silver. They aren't rich, they're likely just buying enough to get by with until they get their next pay check. If they are making big house purchases, they likely saved up the coin over a few weeks of spending XP on it, or saved up XP for a few weeks and spent a bulk Purchase Silver on it. Either way they had to save for awhile to make the purchase. However they weren't limited to "You can't buy that now because you won't have enough coin for the tools for another month."

TL;DR : Assets are awesome, don't get me wrong. I think they're really freaking cool and would be great as a complimenting system to Purchase Silver. One pays weekly on a regular and constant base with possible bonus items if you get T2 or T3, while the other allows you to spend XP(slowing your advancement) on getting that little extra boost of coin you need when you need it.

[Misstery]

I think things that generate and encourage RP should be a very minimal in cost. Messengers and rumours are a huge contributor to scenes and story lines, as they bring people together.

If there is a cost, perhaps use XP or something to that regard, at least for rumours. It's much easier to accumulate. I understand there needs to be a realistic angle, but it's also a RP game, so making things a bit more available to everyone, I think could go along way.

There is a lot of other realism to balance it out.

One of the aspects that I think purchase silver or wealth had was RP generation in many cases, so this would help balance that loss.

[Evrald]

As another note, the entire game for me on Evrald has turned from having fun with RP and being a Merchant taking commissions and making money while dealing with being a savage and dodging whips and being burned for savagery. to a terrible grindfest that's worse than most MMO's I know and gives little to no reward for it.

I was looking forward to a system that rewarded me for putting in time to try and build connections and put in the time to make the assets worth it, while still being forgiving enough to allow me to pay for things with XP if needed.
What I got was something that became the only way to make coin and if I don't spend 5 months collecting asset money, I will never be able to afford a new asset and a system that is completely unforgiving and really making the entire experience less enjoyable.

[Voxumo]

One of the aspects that I think purchase silver or wealth had was RP generation in many cases, so this would help balance that loss.

This is actually an interesting note. With the way assets work, you don't have to be active to make money from those assets, only active for 1 hour out of every 4 weeks. In a small way assets are not conducive to rp, or at least are not tied to it in any meaningful way, whereas purchasing silver... well you needed xp to purchase, and xp could only be gained from rp, or qp which is in turn a result of rp. Purchasing silver was directly tied to rp, and if you never rped, you'd never make money. Even base class weekly payments were linked to activity, and you had to be active that week to get that week's payment.

[Evrald]

One of the aspects that I think purchase silver or wealth had was RP generation in many cases, so this would help balance that loss.

This is actually an interesting note. With the way assets work, you don't have to be active to make money from those assets, only active for 1 hour out of every 4 weeks. In a small way assets are not conducive to rp, or at least are not tied to it in any meaningful way, whereas purchasing silver... well you needed xp to purchase, and xp could only be gained from rp, or qp which is in turn a result of rp. Purchasing silver was directly tied to rp, and if you never rped, you'd never make money. Even base class weekly payments were linked to activity, and you had to be active that week to get that week's payment.

This. A million times this. I don't care how many times it needs to be said, a million freaking times this.

[Puciek]

One of the aspects that I think purchase silver or wealth had was RP generation in many cases, so this would help balance that loss.

This is actually an interesting note. With the way assets work, you don't have to be active to make money from those assets, only active for 1 hour out of every 4 weeks. In a small way assets are not conducive to rp, or at least are not tied to it in any meaningful way, whereas purchasing silver... well you needed xp to purchase, and xp could only be gained from rp, or qp which is in turn a result of rp. Purchasing silver was directly tied to rp, and if you never rped, you'd never make money. Even base class weekly payments were linked to activity, and you had to be active that week to get that week's payment.

This. A million times this. I don't care how many times it needs to be said, a million freaking times this.

Basic payout and assets payout is both tied to the same miniscule RP activity that can be done in random tavern sitting quietly, I hardly see the difference. And the magical money out of nowhere is hopefully not coming back as silver was an absolute joke back then.

[Voxumo]

Basic payout and assets payout is both tied to the same miniscule RP activity that can be done in random tavern sitting quietly, I hardly see the difference. And the magical money out of nowhere is hopefully not coming back as silver was an absolute joke back then.

No they are not Puciek. Basic payout of any kind through the bank does require you to be active for at least one hour a week, I'll give you that. But being able to redeem assets only require 1 hour in 4 weeks. If you have two tier 3 assets, you can make about 500 a week, typically more. 3 of those 4 weeks you don't even have to log on theoretically, except for sometime after sunday to redeem the asset. No rp must be had. 1500 silver easily without ever getting involved with anyone else.

And again Puciek, that is your opinion. Perhaps for those who spend an excessive amount of time on the game, more than your average work week, perhaps for them silver through purchase was ridiculous and a joke, but not everyone spends such amounts of time on the game. On Vicannia it typically took me around two weeks to obtain the 4000 xp needed for 1000 silver, though sometimes that rate was quicker if I found myself in several large scenes. In reality I was making the same amount I made with assets on Vicannia as I made through purchase, in the same amount of time... Roughly.

But yes, the silver appearing as a direct result of rp is far more ridiculous than the silver appearing as a result of... well literally nothing.

Yes purchase silver had the potential to be a joke, but it also had the potential to be balanced. It ultimately came down to player discretion versus coded discretion.


I do feel it is important to note I'm not expecting the game to go back to purchase silver, as staff are making an effort to balance the asset system. It's still new and we are in the roughest time we could be for it. However I also feel it's important for purchase silver to not be made out as this, horrible, broken system as it typically is. It was only broken as a result of players, not the system itself.

[Puciek]

Basic payout and assets payout is both tied to the same miniscule RP activity that can be done in random tavern sitting quietly, I hardly see the difference. And the magical money out of nowhere is hopefully not coming back as silver was an absolute joke back then.

No they are not Puciek. Basic payout of any kind through the bank does require you to be active for at least one hour a week, I'll give you that. But being able to redeem assets only require 1 hour in 4 weeks. If you have two tier 3 assets, you can make about 500 a week, typically more. 3 of those 4 weeks you don't even have to log on theoretically, except for sometime after sunday to redeem the asset. No rp must be had. 1500 silver easily without ever getting involved with anyone else.

And again Puciek, that is your opinion. Perhaps for those who spend an excessive amount of time on the game, more than your average work week, perhaps for them silver through purchase was ridiculous and a joke, but not everyone spends such amounts of time on the game. On Vicannia it typically took me around two weeks to obtain the 4000 xp needed for 1000 silver, though sometimes that rate was quicker if I found myself in several large scenes. In reality I was making the same amount I made with assets on Vicannia as I made through purchase, in the same amount of time... Roughly.

But yes, the silver appearing as a direct result of rp is far more ridiculous than the silver appearing as a result of... well literally nothing.

Yes purchase silver had the potential to be a joke, but it also had the potential to be balanced. It ultimately came down to player discretion versus coded discretion.

So someone who will make massive investment to have 2 Tier 3 money making assets will make money idling than before someone made from basic payout, sure, that's sound and true and applies only to gentry who in old payment system made, with no investment at all, 600 silver a month without lifting a finger beside the 1 rph a week.
And the difference between 1 rph a week or month makes literally no difference, don't try to make it bigger than it is. As it isn't.

And actually that means it helps people who have less time to RP than hurt them, but your own arien example. All you have to do is invest in assets and no matter how little you play you will have a lot of silver, and you won't be devalued by people who can play a lot and constantly purchase silver for XP, because value of silver is relative to it's availability when it comes to PC made items.