Encouraging PC Shops

[Starstarfish]

So as encouraged at the OOC meeting this week, what are some possible ways of encouraging people to visit PC shops versus NPC shops.

- One thought was giving a small rpxp bonus (similar to mail or thoughts) for shopping in a PC shop (discussion on whether or not codewise, that's a thing to determine)

- Possibly raising prices on things like raw foods - if we want people to be able to be play farmers/gardeners - the Queens, the Almshouse, and lots of shops selling things for 1 cp makes any sort of competition hard.

What are other people's thoughts?

[Pixie]

I like the idea of the small RPXP bonus for spending coin at a PC shop, similar to the mail one - 100 RPXP or so, and only once a day?

In general I feel PC shops are promoted so far above NPC shops that it's actually a little irritating at times. The cost of buying from an NPC is astronomical in comparison to buying from a PC. And that's a good thing. Me having been irritated by the cost of buying from NPCs is a good thing, because it means I'll take a PC over an NPC any day of the week.

I'm against the costs of raw foods being raised, as I don't feel that they're goods that PCs really need to be the exclusive providers of. By adding the RPXP bonus when buying from a PC, this would kind of fix itself - the rare PC grocer would be preferable, and we wouldn't need higher costs on things that probably wouldn't cost a full silver from anyone (a carrot, for example).

With all else said, I understand the feeling of frustration that sometimes comes from owning a player shop and going a long while without a sale. I've been filling the same one with wares for nearly 2 OOC years, and there are absolutely some times where you just aren't being bought from. It's very unlikely, though, that the reason why PC shops go without sales is competition with NPC vendors.

A shop-keeper's advice, to be taken or left at leisure!:

Promote your shop with advertisements, often. Don't wait for people to find you.

If nobody's buying your stuff, it's probably the stuff you're selling. Look at what -has- been purchased and change up your stock to cater to what people want. I might love a string I've made, but if it's sat in my shop for weeks and nobody's bought it, it's time to admit that it's just not appealing to other people and try again.

The two keys are promoting yourself, and stocking for what sells.

[myarta]

There is a major category in which these general principles currently don't apply: farming/husbandry. It's possible that this was not really looked at heavily when this system was added.

Here's the thing with husbandry / herbalism (the farming side): There are no strings, and all items are incredibly cheap so there's no leeway to make money. The only way my farmer makes money is thanks to the kind-heartedness of PCs who forego their convenience and make contracts with him instead. With high level mercantilism, basically all staple ingredients are 1-3 silver, so it's not like you can compete on price. If he got a shop, he couldn't stock lower than 1 silver per item so it'd be about the same or only marginally cheaper than just using the NPC shops that people are already used to and have infinite stock. Deals like 10 for a dozen require RP. Or containers like boxes sold as a unit (eating the profits). It's just way easier for people to go to the Queen's Kitchens etc, buy some supplies there while cooking, finish their dishes, and get on with their crafting chores.

Things like woodworking can make it, since you need to spend a bunch of silver to unlock restringing from NPC-bought items, but a PC run farm shop is going to look identical to the NPC ones, be unable to price lower effectively, and be out of stock a lot compared to the infinite restock (16 pork per RL week from one herd). Sure people will come out of kindness, but it's not on a mechanics basis better for them like most of the other trades, where items are expensive enough that they're saving 50-200 silver by buying PC, not to mention they're already strung and look cool. The only item that is priced highly enough that you can make a difference on is horses (or dogs etc) as pets, which is pretty high up the skill tree and still not that commonly sold. You can undercut NPCs by pricing regulars at say 350 instead of 400/500, Lithmorrans at 800 instead of 1000, and Charali at 1250 instead of 1500. OTOH Aios has been trying to sell Charali horses forever: it's not a commonly accessed market item, and it requires people to meet up for RP to know it's available and negotiate it. Unlike the other crafts where you craft, string, and stock (but can also do IC deals and customer finding of course).

So what can help? I'm not sure. For the horse thing, maybe being able to stock pets for sale in your PC shop would be one way to help, but that's a very small part of the bulk of husbandry which is dairy, eggs, beef, pork, etc (and farming-herbalism: wheat, barley, oats, honey, lettuce, etc). I don't see a way to incentivize buying from PCs as much in this field as in other fields except by making things worse for PC cooks by drastically raising NPC food ingredient shop prices to give some space for PC shops to undercut them meaningfully.

[Pixie]

Right, I think that's why they suggested the RPXP bonus for buying from a pshop. That would gently incentivize purchases of the super cheap stuff farmers produce from pshops over npc shops, without having to arbitrarily raise the prices on things that just wouldn't sensibly cost much more than a silver.

[Limonade]

I feel like I recently had the raw ingredients discussion with someone and I still think that it should be submitted as a typo. The farming implementation is relatively recent and I am not sure that NPC prices were adjusted to reflect that you can now shop with PCs.

[Starstarfish]

I thought the small rpxp bonus might help as well. Also just as a thing that is indeed encouraging RP with other players similar to mail/thoughts etc.

I'm not sure you'd need to drastically raise prices necessary, but even sell things at the NPC at 2 cp instead of 1 cp would make a difference.

I'd happily submit it as a typo, I'm just the kind of person who gets super embarrassed when I submit a typo and it's not a typo.


Can I get a confirmation though - can you indeed tool food ingredients and they'll still be usable in a craft like normal? Say ... fish filets or the fruit preserves?

If nothing else then could restring things to be slightly more interesting when offering them in a PC shop.

[myarta]

If people are buying 10 things it may not be worth it to them to stop by the PC shop to see if it has what they need in stock (meat output is difficult to keep up with player needs for some animals with week timers) when they know their usual routine will definitely have infinite stock of it. I wouldn't go very far out of my way to save 10 silver, though to help a PC shop I suppose I might. It's still a very weak incentive compared to the other crafts.

I don't think stringed raw beef steaks and pieces of pork is really a selling point. The string is destroyed once cooked, and it will cost you silver to retool them.

[Geras]

Location, location, location. As others have mentioned, the price point for crafted goods is already pretty good. The trick is making sure people know where to go. Keeping as many shops as possible within 1 travel distance of major RP hubs I think would go a long way.

If someone could work out a way to have multiple backrooms go to a single NPC vendor, I think you could do a lot of good for the merchants by making their common vendor more feasible too.

[Misstery]

I like the rpxp or an incentive for PC shops. I don't think there should be a change to NPC ones or a price raise. Activity shifts drastically and sometimes it's a challenge to find PC vendors. However, I think it's common that people do choose PC ones first when available, I always have. PC crafters also use raw ingredients too, so raising the price has a chain affect.

[Temi]

Can I get a confirmation though - can you indeed tool food ingredients and they'll still be usable in a craft like normal? Say ... fish filets or the fruit preserves?

Yes, you can indeed still use stringed ones.